Egypt's Ali Al-Samman on Freezing Relations With Holy See
By Emil Amin
CAIRO, Egypt, APRIL 15, 2011 (Zenit.org).- The president of Egypt's Supreme Council for Islamic Affairs is noting that a decision to freeze dialogue with the Holy See from Sunni Islam's highest authority may have been hasty.
In 1998, Ali Al-Samman was the architect of the joint committee that brings together the Cairo-based Permanent Committee of Al-Azhar for Dialogue among the Monotheistic Religions and the Pontifical Council for Interreligious Dialogue.
In Part 1 of a two-part interview with ZENIT, Al-Samman offered his perspective on the Jan. 20 announcement of a dialogue-freeze from the Cairo-based Islamic Research Council of the University of Al-Azhar, which came in protest of Benedict XVI's statements on religious freedom following a Jan. 1 attack on a Coptic church in Alexandria.
The great imam of Al-Azhar, Ahmad at-Tayyeb, alleged that the papal comments were an intervention in Egypt's internal affairs.
In addition to the Al-Azhar decision, Egypt also requested that its ambassador to the Holy See "return to Cairo for consultations with the Egyptian foreign ministry," the Vatican reported at the time.
Part 2 of this interview will appear Sunday.
ZENIT: Let us begin by talking about the attack on the Coptic Church of Alexandria in Egypt last December 31. What is your opinion on this painful event?
Al-Samman: All that happened in Alexandria is more than a disagreeable event, and what hurt me even more is to have learned later that responsibility for the event was imputed to employees of the security service.
Moreover, what makes me angry in this type of incident is the delay in initiating the investigations and the delay in punishing those who are culpable, which is in itself more dangerous than the incident itself.
ZENIT: Why are we witnessing, in recent times, growing violence of a religious kind in Egypt?
Al-Samman: In my opinion, one of the main reasons for religious sedition is the delay in punishments.
For example, referring to the case of Al Kamouni, who killed some Copts in the city of Nag Hammadi, we see that a whole year went by before sentence was passed.
Because of this, on more than one occasion -- in articles and television interviews -- I have insisted on the fact that it is necessary to work on the elaboration of laws that concern religious riots that put in danger the security of the nation and it is necessary to apply exceptional, rapid and dissuasive measures.
Extremism continues, which is the spiritual father of all these crimes.
ZENIT: How do you judge the reactions to Benedict XVI's comment on what happened in Alexandria?
Al-Samman: When certain expressions are used by a leader, the evaluation that follows is always more difficult, and the affirmations give the impression that there is an authority that protects Christians of the East; this brings to memory the old sentiments with regard to the protection of the faction of Arab Christians, which history remembers as those who helped Muslim brothers in the face of foreign invasions.
ZENIT: But have Benedict XVI's words merited such opposition on the part of Al-Azhar, which has interrupted the channels of dialogue with the Vatican?
Al-Samman: Personally I am not in agreement with the position of Al-Azhar, in the sense that if I had been the one responsible, I would not have blocked this dialogue in this way.
Perhaps I would have preferred a period of transition, during which meetings would have been held to come to a satisfactory solution on both sides, without having to freeze the dialogue.
Obviously, when I speak of relations between Al-Azhar and the Vatican, I am speaking of one of the most important periods of my life, when I was responsible in the interreligious dialogue at the time of Sheikh Jad Al-Haqq, and until the signing in 1998 of the agreement with the Vatican, with Sheikh Muhammad Tantawy.
ZENIT: Hence, you would have preferred a more prudent reaction?
Al-Samman: Without a doubt, especially because of the fact that in the Vatican there is a large number of persons capable of being intermediaries to resolve the crisis with the least possible damage.
In this matter the Christians of the Middle East are important: their interests, their presence and what we can do for them.
I think that the Pope's words in regard to Egypt were influenced by the earlier attack on the Church in Iraq. This could also have influenced the tone of his statements.
ZENIT: What do you think of the reaction of the Foreign Affairs Ministry, which recalled the Egyptian ambassador to the Holy See for consultations?
Al-Samman: I cannot criticize the position of the Foreign Affairs Ministry. They must hold to their own diplomatic rules.
What is true is that this reflects the state of dissatisfaction produced by the Pope's words, although in reality diplomacy has other functions that go beyond casual reactions. And it is always better to leave the door open to analyze and review these problematic issues.
ZENIT: There are Muslim voices in Europe that have considered mistaken the decision to sever relations with the Vatican. What do you think?
Al-Samman: Without a doubt those who live in Europe are in contact with another, different reality and they coexist in European society with other voices that know a certain language of concord and collaboration. And we are in real need of such voices.
Saturday, 16 April 2011
Friday, 15 April 2011
Antioch Tradition Adorns the Church, Says Pope
Addresses New Patriarch of Maronites
VATICAN CITY, APRIL 14, 2011 (Zenit.org).- Benedict XVI is affirming his communion with the new patriarch of the Maronite Church, and praising the rich tradition of Antioch, where the faithful were first given the name Christians.
The Pope had a private audience today with Patriarch Béchara Boutros Raï, 71.
Last month, the patriarch succeeded Cardinal Nasrallah Pierre Sfeir, becoming the 77th patriarch of Antioch of the Maronites. Cardinal Sfeir resigned at age 90.
The Holy Father said Patriarch Raï's visit was a privilege for the universal Church.
"I rejoice to receive you here, with the Maronite bishops, the priests, the consecrated persons and the faithful, to solemnize the 'Ecclesia Communio,' which I made known to you by letter last March 24."
After a Maronite patriarch is elected, the Bishop of Rome extends his official expression of communion.
He continued: "Your election, which occurred a few days after the closure of the Holy Year promulgated to celebrate the 1,600th anniversary of the death of St. Maron, seems the most eminent fruit of numerous graces that he obtained for his Church."
Plenitude of communion
Noting the Divine Liturgy that was to be celebrated, the Holy Father said that there "the plenitude of communion is manifested between the Successor of the Prince of the Apostles and the 77th Successor of St. Maron, Father and Head of the Church of Antioch of the Maronites, that very prestigious Apostolic See where the faithful of Christ received for the first time the name of 'Christians!' Your Patriarchal Church, her rich spiritual, liturgical and theological tradition, the tradition of Antioch, always adorns the entire Church with that treasure."
The Maronite Church has always been in communion with Rome, even while maintaining its own liturgy and calendar. The liturgy is celebrated in Arabic, except in ancient songs and ancestral prayers of the Eucharist, for which Aramaic is used.
The Church was established by St. Maron, who lived between the 4th and 5th centuries as a hermit on Mount Tauro, an ancient city of northern Syria.
Today the Maronite Church has more than 3 million faithful and is present in Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, the Holy Land, and in countries of the diaspora, such as Argentina and Australia.
The patriarchate is based in Lebanon.
Concrete tasks
Benedict XVI spoke to Patriarch Raï about concrete tasks awaiting him as patriarch, namely the situation of the Middle East and the importance of education.
"This region of the world that the patriarchs, the prophets, the apostles and Christ himself blessed by their presence and by their preaching, aspires to this durable peace that the Word of Truth, received and lived, has the capacity to establish," he said.
The Pope spoke of the Maronites' quality educational and catechetical network.
"Transmit to young people all my esteem and affection while reminding them that the Church and society have need of their enthusiasm and their hope," he said. And he invited the patriarch to "intensify the formation of priests and of numerous young people that the Lord is calling in your eparchies and in your religious congregations. That by their teaching and by their life, they may be genuine witnesses of the Word of God to help the faithful to root their life and their mission in Christ!"
The Pope expressed his prayer for the patriarch, that the Holy Spirit will "console you in difficulties and procure for you the joy of seeing your Church grow in fervor and in number!"
"At the dawn of your ministry," he added, "I wish to repeat those words of Christ to the disciples: 'Fear not, little flock, for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.'"
VATICAN CITY, APRIL 14, 2011 (Zenit.org).- Benedict XVI is affirming his communion with the new patriarch of the Maronite Church, and praising the rich tradition of Antioch, where the faithful were first given the name Christians.
The Pope had a private audience today with Patriarch Béchara Boutros Raï, 71.
Last month, the patriarch succeeded Cardinal Nasrallah Pierre Sfeir, becoming the 77th patriarch of Antioch of the Maronites. Cardinal Sfeir resigned at age 90.
The Holy Father said Patriarch Raï's visit was a privilege for the universal Church.
"I rejoice to receive you here, with the Maronite bishops, the priests, the consecrated persons and the faithful, to solemnize the 'Ecclesia Communio,' which I made known to you by letter last March 24."
After a Maronite patriarch is elected, the Bishop of Rome extends his official expression of communion.
He continued: "Your election, which occurred a few days after the closure of the Holy Year promulgated to celebrate the 1,600th anniversary of the death of St. Maron, seems the most eminent fruit of numerous graces that he obtained for his Church."
Plenitude of communion
Noting the Divine Liturgy that was to be celebrated, the Holy Father said that there "the plenitude of communion is manifested between the Successor of the Prince of the Apostles and the 77th Successor of St. Maron, Father and Head of the Church of Antioch of the Maronites, that very prestigious Apostolic See where the faithful of Christ received for the first time the name of 'Christians!' Your Patriarchal Church, her rich spiritual, liturgical and theological tradition, the tradition of Antioch, always adorns the entire Church with that treasure."
The Maronite Church has always been in communion with Rome, even while maintaining its own liturgy and calendar. The liturgy is celebrated in Arabic, except in ancient songs and ancestral prayers of the Eucharist, for which Aramaic is used.
The Church was established by St. Maron, who lived between the 4th and 5th centuries as a hermit on Mount Tauro, an ancient city of northern Syria.
Today the Maronite Church has more than 3 million faithful and is present in Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, the Holy Land, and in countries of the diaspora, such as Argentina and Australia.
The patriarchate is based in Lebanon.
Concrete tasks
Benedict XVI spoke to Patriarch Raï about concrete tasks awaiting him as patriarch, namely the situation of the Middle East and the importance of education.
"This region of the world that the patriarchs, the prophets, the apostles and Christ himself blessed by their presence and by their preaching, aspires to this durable peace that the Word of Truth, received and lived, has the capacity to establish," he said.
The Pope spoke of the Maronites' quality educational and catechetical network.
"Transmit to young people all my esteem and affection while reminding them that the Church and society have need of their enthusiasm and their hope," he said. And he invited the patriarch to "intensify the formation of priests and of numerous young people that the Lord is calling in your eparchies and in your religious congregations. That by their teaching and by their life, they may be genuine witnesses of the Word of God to help the faithful to root their life and their mission in Christ!"
The Pope expressed his prayer for the patriarch, that the Holy Spirit will "console you in difficulties and procure for you the joy of seeing your Church grow in fervor and in number!"
"At the dawn of your ministry," he added, "I wish to repeat those words of Christ to the disciples: 'Fear not, little flock, for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.'"
Wednesday, 13 April 2011
Islam in Zambia: Small and Notable
Islam in Zambia: Small and Notable
Interview With Author Father Félix Phili
ROME, APRIL 11, 2011 (Zenit.org).- The Muslim community in Zambia is small -- but its presence has been increasingly felt in the last three decades, according to a professor from the Pontifical Institute for Arabic and Islamic Studies who has written a book on the subject.
Missionary of Africa Father Félix Phili authored the book "Muslim Associations and the Resurgence of Islam in Zambia."
Father Phili spoke with the television program "Where God Weeps" of the Catholic Radio and Television Network (CRTN) in cooperation with Aid to the Church in Need about his work and Islam in Zambia.
Q: Father Félix, what inspired you to write this book?
Father Phili: This book actually was a further development of research I had done for my doctoral thesis at the School of Oriental African Studies. I worked a lot with the Muslim community in Zambia to get the information and as this was about them, I promised them I would give something back. So as a matter of intellectual honesty, I wrote it and I provided the possibility for them to see what they gave to me.
Q: Why particularly this book? What was your inspiration?
Father Phili: This was mainly to bring out the existing energy of the Muslim community in our country. Just before I started this research there was lot of concern and fear about the Muslim community and much of it was not really based on objective information. People were speculating on what they were seeing and I found it an interesting theme to deal with for my research and also as a way of bringing about a clear awareness of what this really was about in the country.
Q: Was there a person or perhaps an event that triggered this?
Father Phili: Not really. As part of my training I had studied Islam with the intention of working among Muslims in North Africa and I had already done four years of missionary work in Tunisia. When I was offered the opportunity to do a doctorate, I started wondering what subject I could work on; so talking with some friends, somebody said: “Why don’t you write about Islam in Zambia?” To be honest I was surprised. There are no Muslims in Zambia except for a few here and there, but then they said: “The few who are there, we do not know much about them so it would be good if you can try to research that."
Q: Your book is titled “The Resurgence of Islam," and yet Islam makes up only 0.5% of the population. What is this resurgence -- is it a growth of Islam?
Father Phili: The term is deliberately chosen and is mainly related to the history of this faith community. Practically, Muslims were in the country before Christians, but their presence has only been fully felt in the past three decades or so. So this is a kind of resurgence in the sense that an already existing community becomes more effectively present -- there is a new dynamism within this community. So this is what I meant by resurgence.
Q: You say that Islam arrived in Zambia before Christianity. Where did it come from?
Father Phili: The first Muslims were Arab traders who after a long presence along the eastern coast of Africa slowly started venturing deeper into the continent. Mainly they came as traders who also happened to be Muslims. In their first incursions into the continent they did not spread Islam as such because they only had temporary settlements. But then, slowly with the passing of time some of these settlements became permanent and in their dealing with the indigenous people -- there were a few tribes that collaborated closely with them -- some of these tribes converted in great numbers to Islam. This was the case for a good part of the Yao people from Malawi who are also a contributing factor to the presence of Islam in Zambia. So these are the first two communities to which we can attribute the coming of Islam in Zambia.
Q: Is money, for example for the construction of mosques, clinics and schools, coming locally or is it coming from other Arab or other Muslim countries abroad?
Father Phili: There is no clear evidence of any particular Muslim or Arabic country that is directly sponsoring the development of Islam in the country other than, in an indirect way, the African Muslim Agency. This is an NGO, which somehow facilitates, among other things, the construction of mosques -- but more in the sense of coordinating the construction of religious buildings rather than directly sponsoring the spread of Islam. Within the Zambian Asian community -- where most of them are involved in commerce so they have local resources and high organizational capacities -- some of the simple structures that they have been able to put up especially in the rural areas have been funded locally. There are also some Muslim individuals outside the country who have resources and who offer some work of charity within Africa; these individual families come in and sponsor the building of orphanages and the digging of wells. So there are resources that are coming from outside of the country -- that is true -- but not in a kind of coordinated manner, but more a spontaneous manner.
Q: Is charitable work a big part of Islam or is it something emulated from Christian charitable organizations? I’m curious because it seems a relatively new phenomenon?
Father Phili: I think it is both. On one side you have the Christian model. [...] The Muslim community then somehow replicates this model but the deeper motivation is something that exists within Islam itself through what we call Sacat: every Muslim with a certain income is supposed to pay a certain amount …
Q: Like our Christian understanding of tithing?
Father Phili: In a way you can compare it to that … so this brings together quite a number of resources. These resources are meant to help the poorer members of the community and traditionally you would answer the immediate needs of the people, but with the general development of the society in Zambia, this is also translated in terms of providing education, health and development. So, in a way, they have not just copied our model because within their religious system there is the possibility of bringing together some resources and they are using these resources in a way similar to what Christians have done before.
Q: How are Christians responding to this? Are they worried?
Father Phili: The Christian reaction has been one of mainly forgetting the recent history of how Christian missionaries came to the country. The Christian missionaries have done what the Muslims are now doing. Times have changed. So there have been a lot of allegations against the Muslim community saying that they are actually buying converts with material incentives.
Q: Is that a valid argument?
Father Phili: In a sense it is a valid argument, but as I have said, times have changed so the Muslim community provides the same services that the Christian missionaries did before, which gained them a lot of followers and the Muslims are doing exactly the same thing. [...] The main critique has been that this type of approach is a way of taking advantage of the poor in society because people have material needs; so instead of freely giving them what they need and leaving it up to them to decide, somehow indirectly the way you provide the services makes the person feel that it is an expectation. This has been one of the criticisms leveled against the Muslim community -- to say that they are taking advantage of the poor of society and by providing these services, getting new converts.
Q: This raises the question of how valid that life choice is. If it is out of a moment of convenience or need, how deep does that faith really enter the person?
Father Phili: In a sense that depends on different individuals because, generally, in Islam there is no catechism so to speak. If you have the opportunity, you can be prepared and taught what Islam is before you convert, but in most cases conversion is more or less instant. You learn about being Muslim only after you have converted. So quite a number of these people only discover afterward that actually they have become Muslims. They also realize that the help that is offered is minimal; sometimes it can be reduced to a blanket for example -- though that means quite a lot to somebody in a rural area especially during the cold season -- but then the hope is that by continuously attending the meetings and appearing to be Muslim they might receive more help. So eventually they start learning about becoming a Muslim and they start learning about praying.
When other people, who are not falling for this type of material enticement, start to question their fellow villagers and ask them why they are being led to another religion because of material enticement, to protect their dignity they will start saying that it is not just material enticement, it is because they are convinced. This is to convince those who are questioning and criticizing them that they are in fact serious Muslims. So in the end the whole process can actually lead to a deeper conversion and deeper belief, although there are some people, of course -- those who are only attracted by material interest who -- when they don’t see anything coming their way anymore, they leave. So it is a way of testing.
Q: What is the response of Christians in Zambia? Some African countries have witnessed clashes between Muslims and Christians. Are they concerned?
Father Phili: What has happened so far is mostly more visibility of an already existing community. There has been a long history of coexistence. Many of such types of fears would come more from what is happening elsewhere than what is happening locally because the types of Muslims that most people are acquainted with are distant family members [...] so there is no immediate fear of the Muslims in the country and how they are developing. There is, however, an uneasy association with forms of extremism being experienced elsewhere. In a sense, the Christian community, the Catholic Church in particular, has expressed caution saying that Islam is becoming visible and is growing. What is striking, however, and I think much of it is based on a kind of … I don’t know if I call it prejudice … at the same time that a few mosques have been built around the country, the Jehovah Witnesses have built four times as many Kingdom Halls and that doesn’t seem to disturb anybody, partly because I think they are understood to be on the Christians' side.
Q: How is the Catholic Church trying to work with Muslims?
Father Phili: There have been a few efforts here and there to reach out to the Muslim community. As far as the local Muslim communities themselves, some of them are very open to reaching out to the Christian and to the Catholic Church in particular, but at the moment there are no real permanent structures or means of coordinating a close collaboration between the two communities.
Q: The challenge is that both are missionary communities. Where do we see this going? How do we come together to avoid a potential crisis?
Father Phili: I still feel that within the Muslim community there are changes taking place, especially within the Zambian context, where Christian converts have links with Christians, so that in itself helps to have a more moderate attitude toward the Christians and it is actually these converts who are very helpful in making these bridges.
Q: What was the effect of the Pope’s Regensburg address on this whole question? The Holy Father was criticized, but in the end some Muslim scholars wrote a common letter requesting dialogue. How important was this?
Father Phili: The dialogue came mainly as an aftermath of the Muslim reaction and the initiative that was taken by the 38 and then the 138 Muslim scholars and religious leaders; that step in itself tried to separate itself from the more or less mainstream reaction to the Pope’s speech. So, in a sense that gave a lot of hope within the Muslim community: people who are willing to have a different approach from what is generally experienced in extremist groups. I think, these are the people who need encouragement from non-Muslims because they put themselves on the line, because there are people who do not think like them and who criticize them for responding positively to a non-Muslim call for either dialogue or a review of a certain way of being in today’s world, for Islam in particular.
* * *
This interview was conducted by Mark Riedemann for “Where God Weeps," a weekly TV & radio show produced by Catholic Radio & Television Network in conjunction with the international Catholic charity Aid to the Church in Need.
Interview With Author Father Félix Phili
ROME, APRIL 11, 2011 (Zenit.org).- The Muslim community in Zambia is small -- but its presence has been increasingly felt in the last three decades, according to a professor from the Pontifical Institute for Arabic and Islamic Studies who has written a book on the subject.
Missionary of Africa Father Félix Phili authored the book "Muslim Associations and the Resurgence of Islam in Zambia."
Father Phili spoke with the television program "Where God Weeps" of the Catholic Radio and Television Network (CRTN) in cooperation with Aid to the Church in Need about his work and Islam in Zambia.
Q: Father Félix, what inspired you to write this book?
Father Phili: This book actually was a further development of research I had done for my doctoral thesis at the School of Oriental African Studies. I worked a lot with the Muslim community in Zambia to get the information and as this was about them, I promised them I would give something back. So as a matter of intellectual honesty, I wrote it and I provided the possibility for them to see what they gave to me.
Q: Why particularly this book? What was your inspiration?
Father Phili: This was mainly to bring out the existing energy of the Muslim community in our country. Just before I started this research there was lot of concern and fear about the Muslim community and much of it was not really based on objective information. People were speculating on what they were seeing and I found it an interesting theme to deal with for my research and also as a way of bringing about a clear awareness of what this really was about in the country.
Q: Was there a person or perhaps an event that triggered this?
Father Phili: Not really. As part of my training I had studied Islam with the intention of working among Muslims in North Africa and I had already done four years of missionary work in Tunisia. When I was offered the opportunity to do a doctorate, I started wondering what subject I could work on; so talking with some friends, somebody said: “Why don’t you write about Islam in Zambia?” To be honest I was surprised. There are no Muslims in Zambia except for a few here and there, but then they said: “The few who are there, we do not know much about them so it would be good if you can try to research that."
Q: Your book is titled “The Resurgence of Islam," and yet Islam makes up only 0.5% of the population. What is this resurgence -- is it a growth of Islam?
Father Phili: The term is deliberately chosen and is mainly related to the history of this faith community. Practically, Muslims were in the country before Christians, but their presence has only been fully felt in the past three decades or so. So this is a kind of resurgence in the sense that an already existing community becomes more effectively present -- there is a new dynamism within this community. So this is what I meant by resurgence.
Q: You say that Islam arrived in Zambia before Christianity. Where did it come from?
Father Phili: The first Muslims were Arab traders who after a long presence along the eastern coast of Africa slowly started venturing deeper into the continent. Mainly they came as traders who also happened to be Muslims. In their first incursions into the continent they did not spread Islam as such because they only had temporary settlements. But then, slowly with the passing of time some of these settlements became permanent and in their dealing with the indigenous people -- there were a few tribes that collaborated closely with them -- some of these tribes converted in great numbers to Islam. This was the case for a good part of the Yao people from Malawi who are also a contributing factor to the presence of Islam in Zambia. So these are the first two communities to which we can attribute the coming of Islam in Zambia.
Q: Is money, for example for the construction of mosques, clinics and schools, coming locally or is it coming from other Arab or other Muslim countries abroad?
Father Phili: There is no clear evidence of any particular Muslim or Arabic country that is directly sponsoring the development of Islam in the country other than, in an indirect way, the African Muslim Agency. This is an NGO, which somehow facilitates, among other things, the construction of mosques -- but more in the sense of coordinating the construction of religious buildings rather than directly sponsoring the spread of Islam. Within the Zambian Asian community -- where most of them are involved in commerce so they have local resources and high organizational capacities -- some of the simple structures that they have been able to put up especially in the rural areas have been funded locally. There are also some Muslim individuals outside the country who have resources and who offer some work of charity within Africa; these individual families come in and sponsor the building of orphanages and the digging of wells. So there are resources that are coming from outside of the country -- that is true -- but not in a kind of coordinated manner, but more a spontaneous manner.
Q: Is charitable work a big part of Islam or is it something emulated from Christian charitable organizations? I’m curious because it seems a relatively new phenomenon?
Father Phili: I think it is both. On one side you have the Christian model. [...] The Muslim community then somehow replicates this model but the deeper motivation is something that exists within Islam itself through what we call Sacat: every Muslim with a certain income is supposed to pay a certain amount …
Q: Like our Christian understanding of tithing?
Father Phili: In a way you can compare it to that … so this brings together quite a number of resources. These resources are meant to help the poorer members of the community and traditionally you would answer the immediate needs of the people, but with the general development of the society in Zambia, this is also translated in terms of providing education, health and development. So, in a way, they have not just copied our model because within their religious system there is the possibility of bringing together some resources and they are using these resources in a way similar to what Christians have done before.
Q: How are Christians responding to this? Are they worried?
Father Phili: The Christian reaction has been one of mainly forgetting the recent history of how Christian missionaries came to the country. The Christian missionaries have done what the Muslims are now doing. Times have changed. So there have been a lot of allegations against the Muslim community saying that they are actually buying converts with material incentives.
Q: Is that a valid argument?
Father Phili: In a sense it is a valid argument, but as I have said, times have changed so the Muslim community provides the same services that the Christian missionaries did before, which gained them a lot of followers and the Muslims are doing exactly the same thing. [...] The main critique has been that this type of approach is a way of taking advantage of the poor in society because people have material needs; so instead of freely giving them what they need and leaving it up to them to decide, somehow indirectly the way you provide the services makes the person feel that it is an expectation. This has been one of the criticisms leveled against the Muslim community -- to say that they are taking advantage of the poor of society and by providing these services, getting new converts.
Q: This raises the question of how valid that life choice is. If it is out of a moment of convenience or need, how deep does that faith really enter the person?
Father Phili: In a sense that depends on different individuals because, generally, in Islam there is no catechism so to speak. If you have the opportunity, you can be prepared and taught what Islam is before you convert, but in most cases conversion is more or less instant. You learn about being Muslim only after you have converted. So quite a number of these people only discover afterward that actually they have become Muslims. They also realize that the help that is offered is minimal; sometimes it can be reduced to a blanket for example -- though that means quite a lot to somebody in a rural area especially during the cold season -- but then the hope is that by continuously attending the meetings and appearing to be Muslim they might receive more help. So eventually they start learning about becoming a Muslim and they start learning about praying.
When other people, who are not falling for this type of material enticement, start to question their fellow villagers and ask them why they are being led to another religion because of material enticement, to protect their dignity they will start saying that it is not just material enticement, it is because they are convinced. This is to convince those who are questioning and criticizing them that they are in fact serious Muslims. So in the end the whole process can actually lead to a deeper conversion and deeper belief, although there are some people, of course -- those who are only attracted by material interest who -- when they don’t see anything coming their way anymore, they leave. So it is a way of testing.
Q: What is the response of Christians in Zambia? Some African countries have witnessed clashes between Muslims and Christians. Are they concerned?
Father Phili: What has happened so far is mostly more visibility of an already existing community. There has been a long history of coexistence. Many of such types of fears would come more from what is happening elsewhere than what is happening locally because the types of Muslims that most people are acquainted with are distant family members [...] so there is no immediate fear of the Muslims in the country and how they are developing. There is, however, an uneasy association with forms of extremism being experienced elsewhere. In a sense, the Christian community, the Catholic Church in particular, has expressed caution saying that Islam is becoming visible and is growing. What is striking, however, and I think much of it is based on a kind of … I don’t know if I call it prejudice … at the same time that a few mosques have been built around the country, the Jehovah Witnesses have built four times as many Kingdom Halls and that doesn’t seem to disturb anybody, partly because I think they are understood to be on the Christians' side.
Q: How is the Catholic Church trying to work with Muslims?
Father Phili: There have been a few efforts here and there to reach out to the Muslim community. As far as the local Muslim communities themselves, some of them are very open to reaching out to the Christian and to the Catholic Church in particular, but at the moment there are no real permanent structures or means of coordinating a close collaboration between the two communities.
Q: The challenge is that both are missionary communities. Where do we see this going? How do we come together to avoid a potential crisis?
Father Phili: I still feel that within the Muslim community there are changes taking place, especially within the Zambian context, where Christian converts have links with Christians, so that in itself helps to have a more moderate attitude toward the Christians and it is actually these converts who are very helpful in making these bridges.
Q: What was the effect of the Pope’s Regensburg address on this whole question? The Holy Father was criticized, but in the end some Muslim scholars wrote a common letter requesting dialogue. How important was this?
Father Phili: The dialogue came mainly as an aftermath of the Muslim reaction and the initiative that was taken by the 38 and then the 138 Muslim scholars and religious leaders; that step in itself tried to separate itself from the more or less mainstream reaction to the Pope’s speech. So, in a sense that gave a lot of hope within the Muslim community: people who are willing to have a different approach from what is generally experienced in extremist groups. I think, these are the people who need encouragement from non-Muslims because they put themselves on the line, because there are people who do not think like them and who criticize them for responding positively to a non-Muslim call for either dialogue or a review of a certain way of being in today’s world, for Islam in particular.
* * *
This interview was conducted by Mark Riedemann for “Where God Weeps," a weekly TV & radio show produced by Catholic Radio & Television Network in conjunction with the international Catholic charity Aid to the Church in Need.
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